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	<title>Comments on: Cecil Fielder</title>
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	<description>Voice of the Mathematically Eliminated</description>
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		<title>By: dan1958</title>
		<link>http://cardboardgods.net/2010/01/21/cecil-fielder/#comment-12023</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[dan1958]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Apr 2011 20:17:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cardboardgods.net/?p=4156#comment-12023</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I remember seeing my first baseball fight on TV in 1967. I was 9 years old and living in Hartford. We got channel 8 out of New Haven and my dad adjusted the rabbit ears on top of the TV to get Red Sox games on our ancient black and white 19 inch 1957 model TV. The Red Sox were playing the Yankees. Thad Tillotson pitching against Jim Lonborg in a night game. A day before there was an article in the Hartford Times about Joe Foy rescuing his family in a house fire in his hometown of The Bronx. Here is a description I found of the incident: When the Red Sox descended upon New York for a series in late June in 1967, infielder Joe Foy paid a visit to his parents who lived thirteen blocks away from the Stadium. He discovered their house was on fire and pulled them to safety. The next day, he powered Boston to victory with a grand slam home run.

The next day New York right-hander Thad Tillotson decided to have a go at the man of the hour on June 21. Foy managed to evade the first high fastball, but the second one nailed his helmet. He went directly to first base without complaint, but when Tillotson came to bat in the bottom of the inning, Boston pitcher Jim Lonborg struck him on the shoulder. Threatening Lonborg with retaliation as he trotted to first, the Yankees pitcher was quickly intercepted by Foy who had traversed the field from his third base position. Adopting a belligerent tone and demeanor, he advised his assailant: “If you want to fight, why not fight me? I’m the guy you hit to start all this trouble.”  Rico Petrocelli,  who never shied away from a fight, laid some good hits on fellow Brooklynite Joe Pepitone.. That year Lonborg won the Cy 
Young while nailing 19 batters. He would put an X on his glove for every victim.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I remember seeing my first baseball fight on TV in 1967. I was 9 years old and living in Hartford. We got channel 8 out of New Haven and my dad adjusted the rabbit ears on top of the TV to get Red Sox games on our ancient black and white 19 inch 1957 model TV. The Red Sox were playing the Yankees. Thad Tillotson pitching against Jim Lonborg in a night game. A day before there was an article in the Hartford Times about Joe Foy rescuing his family in a house fire in his hometown of The Bronx. Here is a description I found of the incident: When the Red Sox descended upon New York for a series in late June in 1967, infielder Joe Foy paid a visit to his parents who lived thirteen blocks away from the Stadium. He discovered their house was on fire and pulled them to safety. The next day, he powered Boston to victory with a grand slam home run.</p>
<p>The next day New York right-hander Thad Tillotson decided to have a go at the man of the hour on June 21. Foy managed to evade the first high fastball, but the second one nailed his helmet. He went directly to first base without complaint, but when Tillotson came to bat in the bottom of the inning, Boston pitcher Jim Lonborg struck him on the shoulder. Threatening Lonborg with retaliation as he trotted to first, the Yankees pitcher was quickly intercepted by Foy who had traversed the field from his third base position. Adopting a belligerent tone and demeanor, he advised his assailant: “If you want to fight, why not fight me? I’m the guy you hit to start all this trouble.”  Rico Petrocelli,  who never shied away from a fight, laid some good hits on fellow Brooklynite Joe Pepitone.. That year Lonborg won the Cy<br />
Young while nailing 19 batters. He would put an X on his glove for every victim.</p>
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		<title>By: 4b34r</title>
		<link>http://cardboardgods.net/2010/01/21/cecil-fielder/#comment-10345</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[4b34r]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 Jan 2010 02:57:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cardboardgods.net/?p=4156#comment-10345</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[As a teenager, my first introduction to Carver was &quot;The Cathedral&quot;. My folks had no idea why I suddenly wanted scalloped potatoes and cube steak for dinner all the time. 

Some time later I read &quot;Vitamins&quot; and swiftly proceeded to imitate Carver again. This time it was by drinking prodigious amounts whiskey, not a favorite of mine, with milk (neglecting to understand the milk was likely used to combat the ulcerous effects of the alcohol). The routine did not have a happy ending.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a teenager, my first introduction to Carver was &#8220;The Cathedral&#8221;. My folks had no idea why I suddenly wanted scalloped potatoes and cube steak for dinner all the time. </p>
<p>Some time later I read &#8220;Vitamins&#8221; and swiftly proceeded to imitate Carver again. This time it was by drinking prodigious amounts whiskey, not a favorite of mine, with milk (neglecting to understand the milk was likely used to combat the ulcerous effects of the alcohol). The routine did not have a happy ending.</p>
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		<title>By: johnq11</title>
		<link>http://cardboardgods.net/2010/01/21/cecil-fielder/#comment-10316</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[johnq11]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jan 2010 19:54:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cardboardgods.net/?p=4156#comment-10316</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I just remembered a line in Bull Durham that reminds me of the topic of perception.

If you have fungus on your shower shoes but win 20 games in &quot;The Show&quot;, you will be perceived as colorful.

If you have fungus on your shower shoes but pitch in the minors you&#039;re just a &quot;Slob&quot;.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just remembered a line in Bull Durham that reminds me of the topic of perception.</p>
<p>If you have fungus on your shower shoes but win 20 games in &#8220;The Show&#8221;, you will be perceived as colorful.</p>
<p>If you have fungus on your shower shoes but pitch in the minors you&#8217;re just a &#8220;Slob&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: johnq11</title>
		<link>http://cardboardgods.net/2010/01/21/cecil-fielder/#comment-10315</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[johnq11]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jan 2010 19:50:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cardboardgods.net/?p=4156#comment-10315</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Blanemon,

Those are all valid points you make, especially with the media.

Plus he was an extremely popular with the female Yankee fans. Especially among the over-30 white suburban fans during the 90&#039;s.

Like you said, he hit and played good defense and won 4 WS so a lot of his transgressions were overlooked.

I think what helped him also was that he was already an established ML player that had won a WS with the Reds. As opposed to Jefferies who was young and hadn&#039;t won or accomplished anything.

I just think it&#039;s funny the words used to describe both O&#039;neil and Jefferies for doing essentially the same behavior. O&#039;neil was described as a &quot;gamer&quot;, &quot;competitive&quot;, &quot;high energy&quot; and &quot;Classy&quot;, Jefferies was described as &quot;Babyish&quot;, &quot;Immature&quot;, &quot;uncooperative.&quot;

It&#039;s just interesting to see how people who have a good rapport with other people and are successful are perceived compared to people who are unfriendly and unsuccessful are perceived for doing the same behavior.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Blanemon,</p>
<p>Those are all valid points you make, especially with the media.</p>
<p>Plus he was an extremely popular with the female Yankee fans. Especially among the over-30 white suburban fans during the 90&#8242;s.</p>
<p>Like you said, he hit and played good defense and won 4 WS so a lot of his transgressions were overlooked.</p>
<p>I think what helped him also was that he was already an established ML player that had won a WS with the Reds. As opposed to Jefferies who was young and hadn&#8217;t won or accomplished anything.</p>
<p>I just think it&#8217;s funny the words used to describe both O&#8217;neil and Jefferies for doing essentially the same behavior. O&#8217;neil was described as a &#8220;gamer&#8221;, &#8220;competitive&#8221;, &#8220;high energy&#8221; and &#8220;Classy&#8221;, Jefferies was described as &#8220;Babyish&#8221;, &#8220;Immature&#8221;, &#8220;uncooperative.&#8221;</p>
<p>It&#8217;s just interesting to see how people who have a good rapport with other people and are successful are perceived compared to people who are unfriendly and unsuccessful are perceived for doing the same behavior.</p>
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		<title>By: blankemon</title>
		<link>http://cardboardgods.net/2010/01/21/cecil-fielder/#comment-10314</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[blankemon]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jan 2010 19:09:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cardboardgods.net/?p=4156#comment-10314</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[As a Yankee fan, I can tell you, a lot of it was because O&#039;Neill was very, very good with the media. I think he earned a measure of protection for that (also didn&#039;t hurt that his sister was writing about food for the NY Times). If the NY media had decided he was a jerk, you&#039;d better believe those tantrums would have been written about with malice day after day and he likely would have been run out of town.  

The think about O&#039;Neill&#039;s loony shit-fits is that they were almost all inwardly directed. He usually exploded when he failed to do something, and given how mild-mannered he seemed when talking to the tv &amp; radio reporters, I know a lot of fellow Yankee fans just found it funny.  Whenever an interviewer brought up the subject, he seemed completely embarassed. 

But mostly we didn&#039;t mind because the guy hit .300 a lot and won 4 WS. Let&#039;s be honest.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a Yankee fan, I can tell you, a lot of it was because O&#8217;Neill was very, very good with the media. I think he earned a measure of protection for that (also didn&#8217;t hurt that his sister was writing about food for the NY Times). If the NY media had decided he was a jerk, you&#8217;d better believe those tantrums would have been written about with malice day after day and he likely would have been run out of town.  </p>
<p>The think about O&#8217;Neill&#8217;s loony shit-fits is that they were almost all inwardly directed. He usually exploded when he failed to do something, and given how mild-mannered he seemed when talking to the tv &amp; radio reporters, I know a lot of fellow Yankee fans just found it funny.  Whenever an interviewer brought up the subject, he seemed completely embarassed. </p>
<p>But mostly we didn&#8217;t mind because the guy hit .300 a lot and won 4 WS. Let&#8217;s be honest.</p>
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		<title>By: johnq11</title>
		<link>http://cardboardgods.net/2010/01/21/cecil-fielder/#comment-10313</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[johnq11]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jan 2010 18:08:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cardboardgods.net/?p=4156#comment-10313</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Ramblin Pete,

I never understood the unwavering adoration/blind eye Yankee fans used to have for Paul O&#039;neill. Yes he was a very good player but like you said he was immature, threw tantrums, was a poor sportsmen, and was self-absorbed, and Yankee fans constantly overlooked his behavior. Behavior that would by ridiculed and scorned by Yankee fans if performed by a Red Sox or Met player. 

But Seriously, what&#039;s the difference between what O&#039;neil did and What Jefferies did? I guess O&#039;neil was a better player and won in NYC so his antics were overlooked.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ramblin Pete,</p>
<p>I never understood the unwavering adoration/blind eye Yankee fans used to have for Paul O&#8217;neill. Yes he was a very good player but like you said he was immature, threw tantrums, was a poor sportsmen, and was self-absorbed, and Yankee fans constantly overlooked his behavior. Behavior that would by ridiculed and scorned by Yankee fans if performed by a Red Sox or Met player. </p>
<p>But Seriously, what&#8217;s the difference between what O&#8217;neil did and What Jefferies did? I guess O&#8217;neil was a better player and won in NYC so his antics were overlooked.</p>
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		<title>By: ramblin&#39; pete</title>
		<link>http://cardboardgods.net/2010/01/21/cecil-fielder/#comment-10311</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[ramblin&#39; pete]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jan 2010 17:39:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cardboardgods.net/?p=4156#comment-10311</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Being somewhat &quot;fundamentally&quot; un-read, I&#039;ve always confused Raymond Carver and Raymond Chandler - in my mind, the Garry Matthews and Garry Maddox of letters, as it were. 

As for John Marzano, I always saw him as a real lunchbox-toting, working-class, salt-of-the-earth type of guy, the archetypical back-up catcher&#039;s back-up catcher. 

And I have even more respect for him now, as according to his ultimately tragic bio on wikipedia, Marzano &quot;became a cult hero&quot; in Seattle for doing what I&#039;ve openly fantasized about for years: &quot;Throwing a Haymaker&quot; at that tantrum-throwing poster boy for churlish self-absorption, whining immaturity and poor sportsmanship, Paul O&#039;Neill. 

R.I.P Marz. Here&#039;s to ya.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Being somewhat &#8220;fundamentally&#8221; un-read, I&#8217;ve always confused Raymond Carver and Raymond Chandler &#8211; in my mind, the Garry Matthews and Garry Maddox of letters, as it were. </p>
<p>As for John Marzano, I always saw him as a real lunchbox-toting, working-class, salt-of-the-earth type of guy, the archetypical back-up catcher&#8217;s back-up catcher. </p>
<p>And I have even more respect for him now, as according to his ultimately tragic bio on wikipedia, Marzano &#8220;became a cult hero&#8221; in Seattle for doing what I&#8217;ve openly fantasized about for years: &#8220;Throwing a Haymaker&#8221; at that tantrum-throwing poster boy for churlish self-absorption, whining immaturity and poor sportsmanship, Paul O&#8217;Neill. </p>
<p>R.I.P Marz. Here&#8217;s to ya.</p>
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		<title>By: seaver41</title>
		<link>http://cardboardgods.net/2010/01/21/cecil-fielder/#comment-10301</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[seaver41]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jan 2010 18:36:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cardboardgods.net/?p=4156#comment-10301</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[i love carver, and i always liked cecil, even though i was never a tigers or (gag) yankees fan. i agree that i don&#039;t want to know, in his case, if he wasn&#039;t hitting them legally. perhaps too many mcdonald&#039;s burgers was part of the weight problem for father and son?

since &quot;r-i-f&quot; are the first three letters of my last name, i still hear references to &quot;reading is fundamental&quot; all the time.

i&#039;ve always had a fear of being fat. one of my uncle&#039;s best friends, a sports bookie, was a beanpole until he turned forty, when he suddenly looked like he was giving birth to twins. (no, not the minnesota kind.)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i love carver, and i always liked cecil, even though i was never a tigers or (gag) yankees fan. i agree that i don&#8217;t want to know, in his case, if he wasn&#8217;t hitting them legally. perhaps too many mcdonald&#8217;s burgers was part of the weight problem for father and son?</p>
<p>since &#8220;r-i-f&#8221; are the first three letters of my last name, i still hear references to &#8220;reading is fundamental&#8221; all the time.</p>
<p>i&#8217;ve always had a fear of being fat. one of my uncle&#8217;s best friends, a sports bookie, was a beanpole until he turned forty, when he suddenly looked like he was giving birth to twins. (no, not the minnesota kind.)</p>
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		<title>By: jstefanick</title>
		<link>http://cardboardgods.net/2010/01/21/cecil-fielder/#comment-10300</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[jstefanick]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jan 2010 18:07:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cardboardgods.net/?p=4156#comment-10300</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Also, check out the lineup from that game, Sparky Anderson hit Cecil second in the lineup! I took a look, he hit second the last two games of 1990, I am sure to get more at bats in his quest for 50. 

He certainly wasnt in that spot to slap a single to RF!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Also, check out the lineup from that game, Sparky Anderson hit Cecil second in the lineup! I took a look, he hit second the last two games of 1990, I am sure to get more at bats in his quest for 50. </p>
<p>He certainly wasnt in that spot to slap a single to RF!</p>
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		<title>By: jstefanick</title>
		<link>http://cardboardgods.net/2010/01/21/cecil-fielder/#comment-10299</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[jstefanick]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jan 2010 17:57:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cardboardgods.net/?p=4156#comment-10299</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[How right you are about when &quot;50&quot; meant something! Being a Yankee fan through and through, rooting for the 1990 Yankees was not something for the faint of heart.  You had to really &#039;like&#039; the team. I did, enough that I decided to go to the last game of the 1990 season, not because of my fandom, but that Cecil was stuck on 49 homers with one game left. 

Me and 13,380 fans, Yankee fans or just baseball fans found a hardly full stadium (picture that today, less than 14,000 fans at a Yankee game!), but there was excitement, at least for me, in seeing him go for 50. It WAS why I bought the ticket. (certaninly the 67-95 Yankee team that year did not inspire us).

I was only 11 when George Foster last got to 50 in a season, but that was over in the &quot;other&#039; league, so no AL&#039;er had done it, I am guessing, since Mantle?

In the fourth, against the forgettable Steve Adkins, who, from memory wore something like Number 62, Cecil drove one into leftfield and there it was! 50!

I have some pics, with an actual film camera of him rounding the bases. It was a BIG deal then. Now, not so much, Jose Canseco&#039;s grandmother can hit them out of most parks today. 

Another rememberance of that game, the next time Cecil came up, the Yankees Stadium scoreboard still had up his stats from his first AB, which still read 49 HR. When he came up after hitting the 50th, the crowd expected the board to have the 50HR on it. When the crowd suddenly started yelling and hollering about it, magically, after about a pitch or two, the scoreboard operator changed it to 50 HR. The crowd cheered that. 

Then, I think the at bat after that, he hit number 51! 

Pretty Cool-

And, it was cool having him join &quot;us&quot; in 1996 for the stretch run, not so much a power threat that  he was, but he did get a bunch of clutch hits during the 96 playoffs and WS. Just the threat of the &quot;Big Guy&quot; in the lineup helped that team- remember, the 96 Yankees were not a big power team at all. 

Good stuff, just writing here for the first time, used to read and comment over on your other blog- still checking your work out often.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How right you are about when &#8220;50&#8243; meant something! Being a Yankee fan through and through, rooting for the 1990 Yankees was not something for the faint of heart.  You had to really &#8216;like&#8217; the team. I did, enough that I decided to go to the last game of the 1990 season, not because of my fandom, but that Cecil was stuck on 49 homers with one game left. </p>
<p>Me and 13,380 fans, Yankee fans or just baseball fans found a hardly full stadium (picture that today, less than 14,000 fans at a Yankee game!), but there was excitement, at least for me, in seeing him go for 50. It WAS why I bought the ticket. (certaninly the 67-95 Yankee team that year did not inspire us).</p>
<p>I was only 11 when George Foster last got to 50 in a season, but that was over in the &#8220;other&#8217; league, so no AL&#8217;er had done it, I am guessing, since Mantle?</p>
<p>In the fourth, against the forgettable Steve Adkins, who, from memory wore something like Number 62, Cecil drove one into leftfield and there it was! 50!</p>
<p>I have some pics, with an actual film camera of him rounding the bases. It was a BIG deal then. Now, not so much, Jose Canseco&#8217;s grandmother can hit them out of most parks today. </p>
<p>Another rememberance of that game, the next time Cecil came up, the Yankees Stadium scoreboard still had up his stats from his first AB, which still read 49 HR. When he came up after hitting the 50th, the crowd expected the board to have the 50HR on it. When the crowd suddenly started yelling and hollering about it, magically, after about a pitch or two, the scoreboard operator changed it to 50 HR. The crowd cheered that. </p>
<p>Then, I think the at bat after that, he hit number 51! </p>
<p>Pretty Cool-</p>
<p>And, it was cool having him join &#8220;us&#8221; in 1996 for the stretch run, not so much a power threat that  he was, but he did get a bunch of clutch hits during the 96 playoffs and WS. Just the threat of the &#8220;Big Guy&#8221; in the lineup helped that team- remember, the 96 Yankees were not a big power team at all. </p>
<p>Good stuff, just writing here for the first time, used to read and comment over on your other blog- still checking your work out often.</p>
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